I might be the greatest synth concept designer in the world, maybe you could help either confirm this or burst my bubble. This post contains my original email to Steve Duda from March 6, 2012, regarding a synthesizer concept I had run by him, followed by the email he sent in response... If youve got time, check it out, and let me know how much of an impact you believe this had on the design of his newest software instrument, Serum from Xfer Records. I realize the title Quadrant concept wasnt exactly used, but the similarities (IMO) are pretty notable. Id appreciate your input here, so let me know what you think. -------------------------- Hey Steve, THANK YOU for the plug-in. Ive had some time to utilize it and fall back in love with it, V-Minion really is a monster of a filter. Its actually had me thinking a little bit tho. Im always looking for ways to come up with inventive, new sounds to keep things fresh, even if they dont ever make it into any of my projects (been doing a LOT of hip hop production lately for a local group thats begun to take off). Ive always been a big fan of Z3Ta+ because of its waveshaping, and more recently came out from under my rock to discover why people love Massive. FM8s got some really great features built into it for creating unique sounds as well, especially with its morphing features. I dunno why Im telling you all this like you dont know these things, hahaha. Hear me out though. Late one night, I became inspired by all of these instruments and the V-Minion, and came up with a great concept for a new instrument. However, I have no programming skills. So I figured Id pitch it to someone who did, and maybe one day Id be able to see said instrument on the market? Maybe not... But heres the basic idea. The Oscillators of this synth would have 4 wave forms on a wave table, set up similarly to FM8s morphing quadrants. For example: A | B -------- C | D A being a sine wave, B a sawtooth wave, C a triangle wave, and D a pulse wave. And for simplicitys sake, Im using simple analog waveshapes here, but ideally the synth would have a vast number of choices, and allow the user-assigned waveshapes to be loaded in. This quadrant would make up the first of 4 wave-shaping oscillators. Its unique, but just the tip of the iceberg in this design, and while it is INCREDIBLY complex, the next part is what makes it a joy to use, and EASY to come up with constantly changing, interesting sounds: Driving each of these oscillators, and the central theme of this entire quadrant synth, is an LFO system that quite literally is a replica of V-Minions GUI. 3 LFOs, one determining the X axis, one determining the Y axis, and the third determining the Z axis, which would be the amplification LFO. Havent decided if it would be easier to have dedicated LFOs for each oscillator (which would bring it to 12 LFOs, which would definitely tax the CPU, but these LFOs could be used throughout the rest of the synth using a mod matrix) or to have 6-12 LFOs on a modulation page/tab that could be mapped to the oscillators and everything else via the matrix. Im thinking the ease of use benefits from the dedicated LFOs, but flexibility for the more experienced programmer definitely lies in the latter option, as you would only need 1 LFO routed to every oscillator to get get them all moving in sync. Havent thought too much into that part yet... Anyway, I think this oscillator design alone could create some very interesting timbres, and with 4 oscillators, this thing EASILY becomes the greatest pad/atmospheric synthesizer ever, and with some cunning programming, you can destroy the dubstep world with wobbles that blow Massive and FM8 away. It could potentially be equally devastating with leads. But again, not even the tip of the iceberg... Thats only the oscillators. Lets check out what a quadrant-themed synth would REALLY do... Before we explore the more complex routing of this synth, lets just assume that each oscillator should have its own bus. Old school synths would have 2 oscillators, with 2 filters, which could be run in parallel or serial. So since weve got 4 oscillators, and the theme of the synth is quadrants, lets use 4. Instead of filters, well call them buses, because thats essentially what they will be. So Oscillator A (sticking with the theme of ABCD) gets its waveshape by modulation of its ABCD quadrant, and in its very simplest form, outputs its entire signal to Bus A. B to B, C to C, and D to D. That part is pretty basic. Each bus is going to act as a filter/FX stage, with 4 stages. So youve got Stage A, B, C, and D, which can be run in parallel or serial, or a combination via a selectable routing section that gives you every possible option (Antares had a great routing section on its Filter plug-in, and it would be similar to one like that, or any 4 stage filter plug in). 4 Stage filter plug in? Yes... Ideally, each bus would be very closely related to the design of V-Minion. Excellent filter selection, lots of distortion and other FX. But with our mod matrix already set up and ready to go, all wed have to do to achieve any kind of result is route an LFO to a parameter. Again, if this had dedicated LFOs, wed be racking up CPU usage (bringing the total up to 24 so far, when most of these would probably be very similar at this point for most USABLE sounds, which just adds points for the mod matrix and modulation tab idea). So Oscillator A > Bus A, which is using a modulation matrix to feed its 4 stage filter/FX automation. And the other 3 Oscillators route to their corresponding bus, in its most simplest form. Which gives us a VERY complex selection, which brings us to the GUI for the first time. Each of these quadrants should probably have a V-Minion style grid on them, so users could graphically see the changes that the matrix and LFOs make to the overall sound. And even though the mod matrix makes it possible to change all parameters from one tab/page, each parameter should probably have a small drop-down menu (even if its just a small dot) that would allow the user to make changes to the matrix without being on the mod page, so that they could see the changes being made on the GUI. -------------------------- This part takes a little bit from the OhmForce software instrument Symptohm, and its QuadFrohmage filters, in that each of the 4 outputs has a mixer that determines where its output goes. If you arent familiar, its something like OSC 1, 2, noise, and ring mod or something like that. But you can move sliders up and down for each destination. It basically has one 4 stage filter (which is exactly what their QuadFrohmage filter plug-in is), and this mixer determines which filter each output goes to, and how much. So you can set it to 100% filter 1, or 50% 1 and 50% 2, or 30/30/20/20, as long as it adds up to 100% (for equal output, youd go 25/25/25/25 and adjust the amp setting). Kind of a side thought: Within each of these filters (and multiple other sections of the synth), ideally small amounts of saturation could be applied to fatten up the sound (with controls over these .4% wet settings controlled in a menu somewhere in the global options section to give a little more control; but also could be left somewhat random to act more like analog; Ive even thought about the synth acting like it is warming up, so that the first 2 or 3 minutes that the synth is processing and number crunching, it follows an alternative algorithm that gets closer and closer to the regular settings, but could be frozen at any point, or even selected in this global menu... Ideally, these kinds of small additions applied throughout, with incredibly high oversampling, could create an incredibly fat, analog style sound from a very digital synth) ------------------------- Basically, were going to provide a complex routing system that follows this incredibly intuitive and easy to use quadrant theme and graphical display. Were adding a routing quadrant. This again, will feature the same ABCD quadrant that we have in our oscillators. But we only need an X and Y axis on this one. In its simplest form, Osc A > Bus A. But weve got 4 of the most unique oscillators, and 4x4 stage filters/fx buses. So this routing quadrant, which is modulated by our LFOs via the mod matrix in the same way everything else is (and displayed via the V-Minion-like display), will help to produce one of fourVERY COMPLEX results with its modulated ABCD grid: 1) Each Oscillator outputs to its corresponding Bus (e.g. A=A, etc), and the routing quadrant determines how much signal each bus is receiving (if the routing quadrant is not modulated at all and is centered, each bus receives equal amounts from its corresponding Oscillator; if the X axis is modulated by sine LFO, the buses will alternate input between A/C and B/D at their extremes, but receive proportional input in between the two extremes of the axis...) This could be described as an alternate version of V-Minions 1x4 experimental version. 2) A single bus is selected as a primary bus. Then the Routing Quadrant determines the level of each oscillator to that bus (if the quadrant is not modulated at all and remains in an extreme of both the X and Y axis, meaning a corner, then only one oscillator would output; otherwise, it would always be a proportional percentage). This could be described as an alternate version of V-Minions 4x1 experimental version. 3) All Oscillators outputs are combined into single signal (ideal for monophonic lead/bass sounds), and the Routing Quadrant determines the destination of the monophonic signal. 4) Each Oscillator outputs to its corresponding Bus, and the Routing Quadrant determines which stage receives the input (ideal for Buses that utilize Serial routing). This is yet another variation of V-Minions 1x4 experimental version, although it would serve as more of a 4x4. Obviously, there are other routing options that could be conjured up with a little bit of thought. But these are the 4 most obvious, so thought Id suggest them. Ideally, the synth would include a way to select how the Routing Quadrant handled the signal, so that you could use any of them, rather than being stuck with one static routing scheme (although one static 4 Osc X 4x4 Stage Filter is, in itself, incredibly powerful and flexible). There are some other issues here that should be taken into consideration. The most important being that if a filter or oscillator isnt being used, how it effects the quadrant. I think a system of A becoming the entire left side and B/C or C/D or B/C on the other side would work, and being able to make that user selectable, and making it so that its per-quadrant and not global (so that if Osc A only has 3 waveforms and Bus C has 3 stages, they can use different grid set ups) would be ideal. And then obviously, if only 2 are used, your looking at either a left/right or top/bottom quadrant, which should also be non-global and user-selectable. So there is the gist of it. Yes its incredibly complex. But I think if there is a mod matrix (possibly similar to Z3Ta+) with at least 24 slots, and a way to assign midi controllers to select any parameter WITHOUT taking up a spot on the mod matrix (possibly using a similar matrix for only MIDI CC?), this would easily become a powerhouse in the synth market. The use of CC messages not only helps to reduce its obviously large CPU footprint, which is all but mandatory for modern plug-ins of much use, but also helps to create a more live-friendly performance based instrument, plus itd be a great point to pitch LFOTool to people, as it could be used as CC to modulate even more parameters. It could serve as an extended variation of Massives Macro controls.The instrument could also make use of a step sequencer (V-Minions is a great concept idea, but ideally this instrument would have something a little more complex and with many more steps, possibly up to 64, with an LFO controlled remix feature, where one LFO would control the start point of the step sequencers loop, and the other would control the length [based on the LFOs position when that particular sequence started], with possibly a third LFO controlling the amplitude, to include some variation.) And at any point where I mention LFO here, the step sequencer could be routed to it instead, or one of the (ideally multi-breakpoint) envelopes. And one feature I feel is under utilized in modern synths is the inclusion of simple attack and hold envelopes (similar to Massives LFO envelopes, but they cant be used outside of the LFO). Even one or two of these in any synthesizer makes it much more versatile, even if it has break point envelopes, because you can use one of these simple envelopes instead of tying up a massive modulator to create a simple fade in. And while were at it, we can include a couple of simple ADSR or D(elay)AH(old)DSR EGs, with all of our LFOs on a modulation page. At the end of the chain, I think the instrument could use some global effects. Could be as simple as the same ones available in the buses, but maybe more aimed at distortion/warming. And then possibly a feedback feature at some point in the chain, and definitely a built in EQ with a bit of distortion/warming built into the gain? Anyway, theres my daydream [synth] idea. Let me know what you think. I personally think that, if nothing else, itd produce some very interesting results. And Id have to assume that a lot of the complex programming for this is already done within the V-Minion, itd just be a matter of re-appropriating it to this purpose? Maybe not, I really dont know how that stuff works, or Id have made this thing myself, lol. But regardless, let me know what you think and if its something youd be interested in. Thank you for taking the time to actually read this, and sorry its so long, but I wanted to make sure you knew what I was talking about, cuz its kinda complex. - Rob Bader ---------------------------------- So there it is... and here was Steve Dudas reply: Hi Rob, Thanks for the novel of an email. Vector Synthesis has been around for 25+ years.. Are you familiar with this? vintagesynth/sci/pvs.php and this? vintagesynth/yamaha/tg33.php in software there was this: kvraudio/product/cameleon-5000-by-camel-audio and this kvraudio/product/neuron-vs-by-hartmann and this kv331audio/ that all do vector synthesis. CA5000 was the winner as it actually morphed sounds with FFT re-synthesis. This is all in Alchemy too, though not just the simple vector concept anymore. All considered Im not very interested in vector synths (its old hat to me). The bussing you describe just sounds like a nightmare to program and too confusing to operate (even Symptohm didnt get much sales and it had the real QF built in). If you want to make something like that for yourself, I suggest to pick up NI Reaktor. Theres probably user-made vector synths (since it has XY controllers) and you could just edit something to your own tastes. Best Wishes, Steve ------- So there you have it. If you havent heard of Serum, heres the link. I havent used it yet, but judging from the description, nearly everything except the Vector synthesis part is included (and my vector was nothing more than Massives wavetable concept with user-definable wavetables that could be further shaped using Z3Ta+ style shapers, and then morphed between using a feature similar to FM8s morphing between presets feature; but if I was trying to downplay it, Id call it vector synthesis too, lol). Theres no animosity here, I just thought what I considered my dream synth would be fun to use and wanted to get it to someone who could make it a reality, so whether he stole the idea doesnt matter to me at all, really. At the end of the day, I just want to use the damn thing, and I got it. I just wanted to know what YOU GUYS thought about the similarities to see if I was crazy or really did inspire an unbelievable awesome synth. Hahaha! Look forward to the comments. And thanks for taking the time to read. xferrecords/products/serum/
Posted on: Tue, 07 Oct 2014 04:49:02 +0000
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