Via - Call for a revolution in Ireland I am only thinking aloud on this... You see people posting online how Irish Water is a Semi-State company and that somehow endows them with a special kind of power, like the Revenue and that you simply must register or else you will be put in the naughty corner and your dole/wages/alimony/lottery money/ill gotten gains will be automatically deducted from source. You, know, just like the Property TAX was. Ah shure deyll onlee take it it we dont pay dem! Wha can we do? Yis will all pay in de end yis will! Dey will change the rules and make us pay, you see, dey will!!! So what IS Irish Water? Is it a Government agency or what? Well Im glad you asked. Irish Water is a Private Company Limited by shares. It is NOT a Government agency, neither is it the Revenue so there wont be any taking monies at source, like the Property Tax, unless a judgement is made against you in a court for breaching a contract. Dont believe me? Well check the very bottom of their own website. Look at the small print... water.ie/about-us/company/about-irish-water/ What does Private companies limited by shares mean? Private companies limited by shares are the most common type of companies registered in Ireland and are suitable for most business activities. reddycharlton.ie/news-and-publications/single-view/article/private-companies-limited-by-shares/?cHash=0904abef63b79f9709655ab2cdf5e631 And this... thecompanyshop.ie/company-types/ This is the most common kind of company in Ireland today. Its a business like any other business. It must comply to the same corporate laws as any other business and it is a company that exists independently of the Government, hence why Enda or any other Minister cant comment on what IW will or will not charge you when asked. Its none of their business. Really think hard now. Have any of the ministers told you exactly what you will be charged? No they didnt. They may have legislated and injected public monies into its formation but its still a commercial company and they are simply shareholders, not Managing Directors. That decision power resides with John Tierney, the Managing Director of Irish Water and the regulator. Truthfully it doesnt matter if Father Ted or Bosco were the shareholders. It means nothing to the legalities that Irish Water must comply to as a private company limited by shares.. So why the limited by shares? A Private Limited Company cannot offer shares for sale on the stock market, whereas a Public Limited Company can. This is why the Minister for Finance and the Government currently own the shares and are the only ones that do so currently. It doesnt mean that this company has special powers, like Revenue, because of this or that you are legally bound to interact with Irish Water just because you are a citizen. I suspect they did this because of the liability associated with the cost of the company. If Irish Water went into massive debt, the State would have to bail them out. In fact no company can abuse their position of dominance to get you to be their customer without your consent. Its against corporate and monopoly law to do so. Why? Since Irish Water is the SOLE supplier of water, if they threaten to reduce the water supply pressure, that could, COULD be seen as dominant abuse because the customer has no alternate supplier or option but to pay up to whatever Irish Water demands. Also, because they CREATED the market by commercialising water and creating a private company to bill you for said water and now they must open that market to competition under EU rules so as to ensure that IW does not have sole supplier for the whole country and thus have the power to dominate the market. This is why you will soon see the market opened up to allow other providers sell you water due to competition rules. Listen to a call made to the Competition Authority about the privatisation of Irish Water and the subsequent opening of the market to other suppliers.. https://youtube/watch?v=MPIRNTyBJx4#t=346 So that you may choose which provider you wish to contract with. Its the same as the ESB where the Government have a stake-hold or Bord Gais where they also had a stake-hold until they sold it off to Centrica in order to get your electricity and gas supply, There are others in the market place offering alternative deals now. You must sign up for it and assign yourself the recipient of the bills. Same goes for Irish Water. You must register/apply to receive a bill for services rendered and pretty soon when other providers come on stream, they too will demand a contract before you get your water. This is Privatisation of water, no matter what way you look at it. Once they commoditised the water, it became open to privatisation due to EU competition law. So what happens if we dont register? The truth is, no one knows until they make their move later next year. They may send out these estimate bills in the hope that it would be enough to scare people into paying them, and thus contracting with them for paying or it may be all bluster to get people to register now. The key thing to remember is that you need a contract to receive any service from any company operating as a utility and that contract must be accepted by the customer once offered. It doesnt matter what kind of utility as long as you consciously register to avail of their services. In order for Irish Water to be a success and this a viable financial success, it needs customers and right now its all about scaring you into registering. Have a listen to a solicitor on Highland Radio speak about the Irish Water contracts... Go to 52 minutes in... highland.purposemakers/uploads/Fri_shaun.mp3 He basically states that one would need a contract in order to be supplied with a service and thus charged a bill. He alludes that because this is all up in the air and ad-hoc, any water reduction or claim against those who do not contract is open to serious challenges in the future... Now the issue with your water supply existing prior to all of this. I dont think that has anything to do with this situation since the legislation must get you to contract in order to set up an account on your house and thus give them permission to reduce your supply in the event you are in breach of this contract and then take you to court to get a judgement against you whereby the arrears may be collected by Revenue via your PPS number. We do not really know what they will do or what is legal for them to do because its a grey area that no one has an answer for and it needs to be challenged when the time comes. We shall see what they do... What about those PPS numbers they are screaming about? Incidentally ESB and Bord Gais, being Semi-States, never had access to your PPS number. Both these companies were NEVER entitled to your PPS number for any reason, not even for allowances that may have been offered to you in your household package. To claim any such allowances you had to contact the Dept of Social Welfare and get them to pay these companies on your behalf or to give you the necessary funds to pay yourself. So why did Irish Water get to be the one Semi-State to have the gall to request your PPS number when the others didnt? Its because it makes it far easier for Revenue to get the arrears out of you if you abscond from paying your arrears after you wilfully register your details and thus contract with Irish Water with your PPS number. It means they can track your whereabouts as long as you need access to water and they will never relinquish your PPS number as long as you live. Even your children will eventually grow up and move out and will require water and their PPS number will be ready and waiting for them on Irish Waters books. So it was never really about allowances. They were the carrot to get you to sign up for their service. In fact you really shouldnt rely on those allowances remaining indefinitely because its at the sole discretion of Irish Water as to whether they can afford to continue offering allowances when they have shareholders to satisfy and corporate books to balance. In reality its about tracking you for monies unpaid. Is this the new way of making sure you pay? Your PPS number used as a tracking device against you? Why else would Irish Water need such vital information if not? This is my opinion. As always I welcome your input and please correct me if I am wrong... ~Belenus
Posted on: Tue, 07 Oct 2014 23:25:44 +0000
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